OMG TV moment

[figmo]

My TV turned on to "Sara's Secrets" on the Food Network. She was making a meal that was supposed to be for "both vegetarians and carnivores." One of the items she made was two versions of a savory strada. When she went to plate it, she first stuck her spatula in the sausage-laden strada, then, without cleaning the spatula, stuck it into the vegetarian strada.

I blurted out "Oh my gawd!" so loudly I awoke Warren, who was sound asleep two rooms down with the door closed.

For those of you who aren't chefs, if you're feeding a vegetarian, that's like dipping your spatula in poison before serving your guests.

Comments

[galtine1.livejournal.com]

I'll bet that their email box was bombed this morning. That's the one thing I struggle with when cooking for different needs at home, as we aren't vegan, allergic, whatever. I always ask what's acceptable for them when co-mingling on the grill and will high-temp scorch the grill before "changing up" the meats/non-meats/etc if needed.

[lyzard13.livejournal.com]

for me, grills are usually okay, i just give a little scrape or something before i plop down my tofu dogs or burgers. i usually watch over them so no one accidently drops a big thing of half-done meat on them while they're cooking.

[lyzard13.livejournal.com]

wow - that person has obviously never actually had a vegetarian eat at their house. not to mention that almost every vegetarian i know (including me) would say "eww - does this have meat in it?" just from the contact from the spatula. yuck!

[sfo2lhr.livejournal.com]

I dunno, it's certainly not a "best practice", but there's a wide spectrum of opinion among vegetarians about that kind of thing. Some would be horrified by the "tainted" dish; others would simply avoid any meat-contacted portion; and others would simply ignore it as de minimis.

[shadowsmark.livejournal.com]

I think the point is, if it's supposed to be "for vegetarians" then reasonable attention should be paid to making the vegetarian food vegetarian. It's not as though it was an iota extra work to do it properly--it just takes an iota extra thought.

[bovil.livejournal.com]

It's television, and it's quick television. I'd be surprised if dishing up the meatless version first wasn't scripted. It was likely just a slip-up in filming that nobody caught.

[figmo.livejournal.com]

To me she showed an amazing lack of consideration, something that IMHO should not be done by a food professional. If the "meat" were instead "mushrooms," I'd be in the hospital from eating the "safe" dish.

FWIW

[capplor.livejournal.com]

Fred, the house vegetarian, doesn't care about whether the grill is cleaned of meat-stuff before doing his veggies. What infuriates him is the idea of "I'll serve you the same as everyone else -- just pick out the meat". Whether he eats it or not, an animal died for that dish, which is most of his interest.

Re: FWIW

[figmo.livejournal.com]

The point I was noting was her total inconsideration for the vegetarians.

When catering to vegetarians and carnivores at the same meal, it's good practice to always use separate plating utensils.

[madfilkentist]

I wonder how the amount of meat-stuff transferred on the spatula compares with the amount of insect life which people inadvertently ingest in their daily lives.

[dan-ad-nauseam.livejournal.com]

The issue is avoidability. As noted in OP, the meat dish contained sausages. I'd expert a person keeping Kosher to have exactly the same reaction.

[figmo.livejournal.com]

I kept thinking "if that sausage had been mushrooms, I'd have been in the hospital."

She could have at least dished the vegetarian entree first (the only difference between the two, AFAIK, was the inclusion of sausage in the carnivore version).

Better yet, the show could have budgeted for a second spatula so each version of the strada could have its own uncontaminated plating utensil.

[howeird]

I kept thinking "if that sausage had been mushrooms, I'd have been in the hospital."
Meat won't kill a vegetarian, and vice versa.

She could have at least dished the vegetarian entree first
It's the same as milchig vs fleishig - you use a different spatula.

[figmo.livejournal.com]

Meat won't kill a vegetarian, and vice versa.

Depends upon the carnivore and the vegetarian. I can think of at least one carnivore who'd have been in the hospital from the sausage-laden strada, and if someone were to flip a Gardenburger_TM with a spatula and then use it on my burger, I'd be in the hospital, fighting for my life.

[madfilkentist]

In fact, I was thinking that two, which is why I consider the "poison" comparison to be overblown. Getting a small amount of mushrooms into your food means major trouble; a trace amount of meat in a vegetarian's food isn't going to do anything.

Was it discourteous to use the same spatula? Yes. Was it over-the-top, screaming AAARGGGHHH, I've been poisoned? That's silly.

[figmo.livejournal.com]

This has nothing to do with whether it's right or wrong to be vegetarian; it has to do with consideration of folks with differing dietary needs and choices.

Given that the only difference in the two stradas appeared to be the inclusion of sausage in the carnivore version, if she only had one spatula, she should have plated the vegetarian one first.

A better solution would have been to use separate spatulas for each. You never know whether someone's a vegetarian by choice or because of a meat allergy (I know at least one person who's severely allergic to pork).

[bovil.livejournal.com]

A friend of mine doesn't keep kosher, but he eats no pork. He's allergic to pork and rabbit.

Your initial argument would have probably stood up better if you had avoided the hyperbole. Mixing utensils is inconsiderate, and if done intentionally, disrespectful, but hardly murder in the general case. In the case of a food allergy, it's always best to be specific rather than reply on the general.

Even in just discussing vegetarianism, it's best to be specific. There's such a spectrum, and what's "vegetarian" to one (say refined sugar, which doesn't contain animal products but often uses animal products in processing) might not be to another.

[ashi.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I would have emailed right away on that one if I'd seen it.

[trinsf.livejournal.com]

When I cook for a mixed group (as for Thanksgiving and cookouts), I treat the meat/vegetarian thing as if I'm keeping a kosher kitchen. I even have a separate grill that I use for vegetarian things, so that when we grill out, those things never get anywhere near where meat is or has been. Separate utensils, separate sides of the kitchen for prep, etc.

[justeps.livejournal.com]

"I'll have the real food and my PETA-sympathizer friend here will have the fresh baby spinach." (Sorry, couldn't resist...)

[capplor.livejournal.com]

I know that you meant it as a joke, but some people would find that just plain mean spirited.

As a vegetarian I still get lots of people thinking that they are being an absolute riot when they refer to me eating rabbit food & them eating real food, as if some poor critter has to die before you can live. The only thing more real about eating meat is the fact that somewhere a cow, a pig or a chicken (in most cases) died for your "Buzzard food". The way the stuff is prepackaged and whatever any more most people are entirely removed from the process so they are not aware of the suffering their choices cause.

I could go off on a rant about how vegetarian choices are better for your health & the overall health of the planet but that's entirely counter to the point that Lynn was originally making. That point is courtesy.

If I'm serving food to someone who's keeping Kosher you can bet your sweet potatoes that I will comply, to the best of my ability to abide by the rules of a Kosher diet. If I'm serving food to a mixed crowd of veggies and carnivores I will attempt to, in any way I can, keep the portions & the utensils separate.

As Robin stated above, I'm not so strict that I will require a separate grill when I cook my veggie-burgers or my portabella mushrooms, I just don't want to have to pick the little pieces of meat out of my "garden" salad. (& yes, I've been faced with that situation) If there is any doubt about how strict the individual is, or needs to be, then one should either ask or attempt to be stricter, merely as a courtesy. You might still fail, but at least you have tried & most people can appreciate that.

As for the current spinach scare; they're saying don't eat the stuff raw. I'll take a plate of it lightly steamed with some pepper & balsamic vinegar, thank you. Would you happen to have a roll to eat alongside?

[justeps.livejournal.com]

If you remember my parties, you'll recall I had two Crock Pots: one that contained meat, and one that never touched meat in its life.

The rest of this is largely a religious argument. The most perfect person on the planet, his holiness the Dalai Lama, is OK with eating meat. That's good enough for me.

Humans aren't rabbits. We can't digest grass. We can digest grass-fed beef. You can debate all you want about whether we evolved into carnivores, or were "intelligently designed" to be carnivores. It doesn't matter; we are what we are. Parsley is decoration, not food. Celery is not nutritious.

You're welcome to eat whatever you want. Just don't preach to me about what I should or should not consume.

[capplor.livejournal.com]

Did you even read as far as: "I could go off on a rant about how vegetarian choices are better for your health & the overall health of the planet but that's entirely counter to the point that Lynn was originally making. That point is courtesy. "?

I'm not telling you what to eat. That's not my choice. Why do people think that I am doing so when I espouse an alternative dining-style?

Maybe the real problem is not one of courtesy, but rather one of expectations.

[tsennyipa.livejournal.com]

I think this is just about exactly analagous to mixing the milchig and traifdig spatulas. To someone who's serious about keeping kosher, it's a major nono. To someone who just doesn't want to choose the death of an animal, it's not a big deal. To someone who's a meativore, it's beneath notice.

I think cooking schools actually tend to foster this attitude about meat versus vegetarian. Vegetarian is like this weird thing you do as an alternative to meat, rather than an actual culinary tradition. It was nice in our hotel in Delhi because there vegetarian cooking really is a culinary tradition, and so at this five star hotel they had *really* good vegetarian food.

[figmo.livejournal.com]

When my mother was in restaurant chef school they had an afternoon-long seminar on "How to Cook for Vegetarians." Some of the recipes were interesting, but the sweeping generalizations made by the woman teaching the seminar were ludicrous. "Vegetarians don't like smooth textures; they like things chunky" was one of the examples. I always thought there were just as many vegetarian palates as there are vegetarians, and so far personal experience has proved me right and Mom's instructor wrong.

To get really good vegetarian food you need a chef who eats vegetarian food and likes good food. I've had some phenomenal vegetarian dishes over the years, and although I'm an omnivore, I find the "weird thing" attitude about vegetarianism to be somewhere between annoying and frustrating. Sometimes I don't want to eat meat for whatever reason, but that doesn't mean I don't want a tasty and balanced meal!